Rotation from landscape to portrait being ignore...

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Rotation from landscape to portrait being ignore...

Postby sirih » Sun Mar 07, 2010 8:33 am

OK, here's what happens. I upload pictures from my camera to my hard drive. Wallpaper Cylcer notices I've added something to my Images folder and kindly tells me so. But, after I've uploaded the pictures, I rotate to portrait those that were taken in portrait mode, so that they display correctly in _any_ application. BUT, Wallpaper Cycler doesn't pay any attention to the changed image. It shows pictures that are actually now in portrait in the original landscape format.

This is driving me crazy! I have looked all over the place for some kind of Refresh Everything function, but haven't found anything. Please, can someone advise me on how I can get WPC to display pictures as they actually exist on my hard drive? (If it's relevant, I have the Lite version.)

I will be _extremely_ happy to get a solution to this!

Thank you :-)
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Re: Rotation from landscape to portrait being ignore...

Postby Marc G » Wed Mar 10, 2010 4:53 pm

I assume you are talking about the thumbnails being wrong.
You can update the thumbnails with Tools > Manage Thumbnail database.
Try the default settings and just hit "Execute Operations".
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Re: Rotation from landscape to portrait being ignore...

Postby sirih » Thu Mar 11, 2010 1:04 am

Hi, Marc

No, I was talking about the wallpaper being wrong. I hadn't looked at the thumbnails.

However, I have done what you suggested (including Force Update). The problem remains (and now I can confirm that the thumbnails are also wrong for these rotated pictures - they still show images that have been rotated into portrait format in the original landscape format). Other applications - for example, Microsoft Office Picture Manager and, of course, my image editing software (Paint Shop Pro) - show the images correctly.

While I was doing this, I also noticed something else: WPC has retained information about folders that have been renamed. So, say I had a folder called 'My Family' and changed it to 'My Family at the Zoo': WPC shows both folders in the tree view. The contents of the now non-existent 'My Holiday' are the names of the original files, all marked Not Valid.

So, sorry, I have now asked about two issues! FYI, I have WIndows XP, Service Pack 3, and have WPC 3.6.0.180 Lite.

Any suggestions on fixes for either issue?

Thanks,
Siri
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Re: Rotation from landscape to portrait being ignore...

Postby Marc G » Thu Mar 11, 2010 8:57 am

Can you please send me one of those pictures that is behaving strange? Preferably, the original image + the rotated version.

Regarding the second issue, the Automatic Folder Synchronization feature does not remove any folders or files, it will only add new files. So, if you rename a folder, it will see that as a new folder.
To find all non-existing files in your wallpaper list, you can use Wallpapers > Find > Find Non-Existing Wallpapers.
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Re: Rotation from landscape to portrait being ignore...

Postby sirih » Thu Mar 11, 2010 3:05 pm

Hi, Marc - I can't upload to the site, it keeps timing out. I have found the smallest file I can - it's 1.6MB in the original, and just under 1MB in rotated form. Can you provide an email address that I can send the pictures to?

Cheers,
Siri
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Re: Rotation from landscape to portrait being ignore...

Postby Marc G » Thu Mar 11, 2010 4:41 pm

Yes, please send to "marc DOT gregoire AT nuonsoft DOT com"
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Re: Rotation from landscape to portrait being ignore...

Postby Marc G » Fri Mar 12, 2010 8:46 am

Thank you for sending me the pictures by email.
I took a look at them and my suspicion was confirmed.
JPEG files from most camera's contain EXIF information. This EXIF data contains things like, focal distance, flash fired or not etc, but also an orientation. When you take a picture, the camera will figure out how you are holding the camera and stores this information in the JPEG. If you add the original image to Wallpaper Cycler, right click on it and select Show EXIF Data. A new window will display all the EXIF information for that image. You'll see that orientation is set to "right-top". This actually means that if you view the image without any rotation, to get it to view correctly, the left-top corner should actually become the right-top corner. Wallpaper Cycler understands this and will automatically rotate the images according to this orientation.
Now, if you add a processed image to Wallpaper Cycler and show it's EXIF data, the orientation data is still "right-top". So Wallpaper Cycler is still rotating them to match the orientation.
So basically this is not a bug in Wallpaper Cycler but a feature.
Instead, the program that you are using to rotate images should change the orientation bit to "right-left".
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Re: Rotation from landscape to portrait being ignore...

Postby sirih » Fri Mar 12, 2010 5:40 pm

Hi, Marc

I appreciate your work on this, and your explanation. I understand the logic behind WPC's rotation action. However, while you describe this as a feature, it doesn't explain why all other applications (e.g. Microsoft Office Picture Manager, Google's Picasa, Paint Shop Pro, Windows Explorer thumbnail view, Dreamweaver, to name a few) are able to interpret the EXIF data to display the rotated images correctly.

I don't believe I can control what Paint Shop Pro does - that is, I can't tell it to alter the EXIF orientation information when it rotates an image.

Basically, it comes down to this: I have to choose between being able to view images correctly with WPC only (i.e. by not rotating the images manually), or being able to view images correctly with all other applications except WPC. Oh :-(

Thank you once again for being so thorough in your investigations - I am grateful for all your efforts.

Best,
Siri
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Re: Rotation from landscape to portrait being ignore...

Postby Marc G » Fri Mar 12, 2010 5:55 pm

Do these other applications correctly rotate the original image?
I think not, so in other words, they ignore the EXIF orientation tags completely.
Even the image viewer of Windows itself still does not interpret EXIF tags.
However, I know image programs that at least alter the EXIF tags when rotating them. For example, Corel PhotoPaint and Windows image viewer itself.
So maybe that's a solution. Use the following procedure:
  • Copy all images from your camera to your PC
  • Use the Windows image viewer to rotate them. (Note: you can even select multiple images in Windows Explorer, right click on them and rotate them clockwise or counter clockwise.)
  • Then manipulate the images in your favorite editor to straighten them.
This should work, because I think Windows Image Viewer will properly set the orientation tag.
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Re: Rotation from landscape to portrait being ignore...

Postby sirih » Fri Mar 12, 2010 6:33 pm

No, these other applications don't rotate the image. As you say, they are ignoring the EXIF orientation information completely.

I have done a bit of experimentation with the Windows Image Viewer, using its rotation function. I then looked at the EXIF data: now there is no Orientation information at all! The picture rotated with the Windows Image Viewer displays correctly in WPC. So, presumably, what WPC is now using is the pixel height and pixel width dimensions data to figure out how to display the image. Which I'm guessing is what the other applications have been doing all along since, as you point out, they ignore the EXIF orientation information even if it's there.

Now I have to ask myself whether I want to go back over hundreds of photos, redo the rotation with Image Viewer, and then redo the straightening where necessary... And, actually, I no longer have the original files for many of them, only the last four hundred or so. Hmm.
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Re: Rotation from landscape to portrait being ignore...

Postby Marc G » Fri Mar 12, 2010 6:35 pm

Another solution for old pictures might be to use the rotation of WPC itself.
Select pictures that are wrongly rotated in WPC and then in the banner below, select the correct rotation that you need.
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Re: Rotation from landscape to portrait being ignore...

Postby sirih » Mon Mar 15, 2010 2:35 am

Hi, Marc

I thought, well, okay, maybe I can just deal with this 'phenomenon' on a one-by-one basis. If an image comes up on the wallpaper and I see it's in the wrong orientation, I can just tell WPC that, in the future, it should show this image rotated.

However, perhaps I do not correctly understand your instructions. I spotted an incorrectly presented wallpaper. Aha! It is at this point that I realize I don't understand what you mean by "the banner below." Not knowing how else to directly address the image currently on screen, I open WC and select 'Highlight Current Wallpaper'. Then I right-click the selection and choose a rotate by x option. Only that doesn't appear to have any effect. I feel like an idiot. I try a number of variations. Nothing has any effect. I consider punching myself in the head, as it appears that I am unable to understand apparently simple instructions; Ithen realize that I long only to be be subjugated by this program, in order that I may see my photos presented in the same orientation in which they were originally taken. Then I resist being dominated - I am a not a number, I am free! Free to tilt my head to try to see my original vision of photographs that I took.

Subsequently, I buy a bottle of wine and drown my sorrows.

Siri
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Re: Rotation from landscape to portrait being ignore...

Postby Marc G » Mon Mar 15, 2010 6:38 pm

Ah, but wine is good and red wine is even healthy ;)

Sorry, if the instructions were not clear, but actually you understood them. With "banner", I mean the blue bar at the bottom of the main windows of Wallpaper Cycler. However, you used the right click menu which also works.
When you select a rotate by x option for a wallpaper, the thumbnail will unfortunately not reflect this rotation.
However, when you double click that wallpaper, WPC will render that wallpaper to the desktop and that should be rotated according to the setting you selected.
Can you confirm this?
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